CHA Initiative

[freshwind]

I just have to post about this. For those that don't know the CHA has launched a new initiative about getting the parents to calm down. They are blaming the parents for what ails minor hockey by thinking that "little Jimmy" will get to the NHL and be rich.
Now, I have been hanging around rinks since the 60's, and while there are some loony parents, they have always been around. I remember a few parent's fights when I was a kid, it happens.
What bothers me most, is that this is blaming people that have the ABSOLUTE least impact on the game at all. We have seen a number of studies over the last few years that talk a mighty talk, yet do nothing to right the wrongs we have inflicted on our kids.
Is it the parents that have set minor hockey up as a cash driven sport? Our so called elite system has nothing to do with talent, but more to do with money. It costs thousands of dollars a year for a kid to play triple A here in southern Ontario. Do kids at 7,8 or 9 really need to play 60-70 games a year, and do that much practising as well? Then hockey school, then summer hockey? Should kids that age be playing travelling hockey, staying up late and not getting homework done?
Junior clubs have expanded like crazy accross this country and now they are grabbing bantam age players to play junior b and tier 2 junior a. This is absolutely ridiculous. A midget age player should be able to make the jump to Major Jr A ONLY, that would allow the truly elite to move up. The rest, should be forced to stay and play their bantam and midget years. This would build a broader base for players and ultimately raise the quality of the game. We do this with major a players who don't stick in the NHL, so why not kids who don't stick in major a?
We have kids hockey teams in Toronto who are trying to bribe 7 year olds to play for their team~offering all equipment and sticks, kids bring only their skates.
Competition is supreme, and it is win at all costs. Greg Millen was asking the other day why Nova Scotia is the only minor hockey group in Canada that requires coaches to give equal ice? Parents get upset because after they pay thousands of dollars, drive 75 miles to see little Jimmy sit on the end of the bench and get 50 seconds of ice time how can you blame them.
Officiating is horrible, there is no support. They are losing 1000's of refs a year, and yet there is no accountability for this. They say there is 0 tolerence for parents, coaches and players, yet the referees are allowed to go along merrily for fear of them leaving. The young guys coming into the NHL are proof our current system doesn't work.
Minor hockey is in a mess, and I don't see any changes on the horizon. It is sad.
Our base is getting smaller, and as it dwindles so will our #'s going to the NHL, especially at the skill positions.
This is the one area I disagree with "uncle Don", our hockey is not fine, it is ill, and if we don't hurry our patient will be lost.

[Thibault]

It can be improved......and the parents must improve. I've been a bit through that with my dad and it ain't fun lemme tell ya!!!

[CL]

You are dead on with your position FW. Having spent well over twenty years at various levels of minor hockey, I am far more disgusted with the attitudes of certain officials (organization executives - not referees) than I am with some less than gentle parents. In fact, I have witnessed several blatant attempts to characterize parents with concerns as little more than troublemakers. Quite often, it is the inability to approach league officials that has frustrated many "normal" people into behaving less rationally. In one case, I have seen a league president actually provoke a public altercation with a parent who had legitmate concerns with how hockey fees were being spent within his particular organization.

I think Bob Nicholson has merely tried to package a specific problem and use it as a general remedy in what is a far more complex situation. When I hear about some of the partying that went on at the Canadian delegation accomodations during the Salt Lake Winter Olympics, I am tempted to think that Nicholson is merely trying to fire a discouraging warning shot across the bow of any group of parents who may seek an accounting of how minor hockey operates. In other words, Nicholson is simply trying to protect the perks and privilege he and many other minor hockey officials enjoy at parents expense.

The problems in minor hockey are serious and they affect every aspect of the game. Rather than trying to centralize things as a form of empire building, minor hockey officials should be striving to eliminate those things in the game that permit less scrupulous individuals from profiting either financially or by reputation where such profit is not deserved. As it stands now, just about everyone involved in nearly every capacity of import (municipal governments, hockey executives, some service organizations, some refereeing officials, and certain corporate interests) are guilty of screwing our children out of what should be a fun activity.

[freshwind]

I hear ya CL. When I get time this weekend I am going to post my experiences over the last 24 months. It bothers me that my experiences are probably very common.

[MapleBud]

What an ugly picture. I haven't been involved in minor hockey since I stopped playing it. I really don't remember it being that bad, and like I mentioned before, it wasn't until I reached the midget level and then junior that I became disgusted with how it was being played.
But most of my memories as a kid are good ones. The coaches were generally helpful, it was a blue moon when I had to listen to a vocal parent and I rarely had any trouble getting ice time. The only instance I saw of favourtism was the year I made the jump from houseleague to EHA in the early part of the season. The houseleague team didn't want to let me go, so they allowed me to play both, with my parents only paying for the EHA. Why did I deserve any special treatment in that scenario?

I noticed the mention of Nova Scotia has the only province to adopt an "equal playing time" for all the kids. Just out of curiousity, who manages this fairly?

[CL]

Parents in the stands with stopwatches.

[MapleBud]

Ok thats still not fair. Some use Timex and the rich use Rolex.

Honestly though, sounds like a great idea and should continue while the kids are young. How long has this been going on over here? I'd be interested to see if it's worked.

[CL]

Actually it doesn't work that well. Just angers coaches and makes them quit.

As for the watch situation. The rich only think they are timing with a Rolex.

[cranapple]

F.W. and I have exchanged info on southern ont. and of course, having played, coached and ref.ed I agree with every thing said. Just a couple of happenings and situations, have no idea how many nights/days that I spent, myself, in rinks, probably an average of 4 nights a week from when I was 12 to 30? during the hockey season then post season leagues and summer. my son from the age of 10 played more than I , with reg. league play plus high and summer jr. and I didn't miss many of those. Point being, we have been around the rinks pretty steady and still are as I still go to as many "B" games as I can. I was , I guess lucky because I had a ball coach , yes ball, who taught me and others how rabbit ears could influence your play. I think I carried this to the ice. Talked a lot but heard little. You know, I really can't say that parents where ever a problem for me,sure there are a few who are louder than others they pay the frieght and I respect that. The remarks on league officials and on ice officials are so true. I can sit here to-day and can tell you that on any night in any league from 3-A to jr. "D" or "B", the on ice officials had no respect for the game or players . They just where not up to the standard of play. Not every night. I ref.ed in the T.H.L., and talk about rough! butt ends as you skated by the bench or a water bath as you backed into the bench area and always a little"oh sorry ref". when I was coaching, I was in a summer jr. league against a coach who really didn't have a great amount of experience and I matched lines and he didn't like it and going off under the stands challenged me!!Nothing more agressive than a bunch of high schoolers jammed into a small rink for a playoff game.There will always be the parent who just can't give up on the quest for bigger and better things but I found , as the players moved into better levels, the parents became more knowledgable, understood winning and losing and what a coaches job was and appreciated it even if it meant his kid only got 2 or 3 shifts a period and usually none in the last 10 min. if they where losing. I did it. The thing being, there was always a league at a lower level but they choose to stay up. in fact, if a kid starts with a team , he should try to finish the yr. with it regardless, at least he is getting good practice at a good level. In my sons last yr. in high, his "D" coach was a good hearted teacher who was just"on the bench" so with my sons experience, he would make the changes,in pressure spots, while the poor bugger was trying to figure out what was going on!!! This is all great stuff. I would not change it a bit. Minor hockey is in big trouble. we are over instructing on ice officials. we are carding coaches who have little playing experience,we are voting in league officials just because they put there name up rather than making it manditory that they understand what they are getting into and understand the mission statement. Listen to cherry.

[freshwind]

This "initiative" will do nothing to help hockey as it still does not address the whole structure of the game in Canada.
Let me tell you about my little sojourn over the last few years.
I had been involved in hockey my whole life, as a player, coach and referee. I coached in the old "police minor" system here in Hamilton, and refereed competitve hockey in both Hamilton and Stoney Creek. I attended the OHA official's camp one year but alas did not advance any further.
I sort of gave up a lot of the involvement when we started a family. When my oldest began to play hockey, I had decided I wanted to be a parent and enjoy the games.
After a couple of years of watching him learn nothing from some people that had no concept of how to run a practice, let alone a bench I called a friend I had in another association and wondered if I could get my boy in, and was there any coaching openings.
Well, we switched affiliations, ended up coaching with a fellow I had known for years. (he actually has probably forgotten more than most know about the game)
We set the rules down hard and fast. Work hard, have fun, and we will do our da*nedest to make sure every one gets equal ice.
To make a long story short we had a pretty good run together. A few years ago we took a team that shouldn't have gone anywhere, and won our league championship and took the team to the next round of inter league play. It was great for the kids, and we had a lot of fun. Sounds good but this is where the true colours came out.
During the playoffs one of the "executives" kids received a 1 game suspension, I pointed out to the league that under our rules it should have been 2 games. I was right, the suspension was 2 games. Well it was this team that we narrowly beat out for the championship. (cont'd)

[freshwind]

Now in the next round we were playing a game where the action had gotten quite a bit out of hand. There were a number of times all hell almost broke loose. Their team was extremely dirty, and we were not used to it. At the end of the game the only thing important to us was the fact that we could advance, and they couldn't. At the end of the game there was some pushing and shoving, and we called our guys to the bench. The refs went to centre for the handshake, we sent our players to the dressing room. As they were going off the referee came right onto our bench and asked me what I thought I was doing. I replied that I was protecting our kids, since it was obvious to anyone with half a brain he had no F'n clue as to how to control a hockey game.
He said you just bought yourself a gross.
Fast forward to the next fall, and I asked one of our VP's how this would be handled, and did I need to go to the executive meeting. He said it was no big deal, the game report didn't say much, and it would probably be a game or 2.
When I showed up at the coaches meeting I was told it was 6 weeks, no games or practices. At this time I was told they took my record into consideration before making the decision. This floored me, I had never even gotten a bench penalty in this association. As it turned out, after speaking to one of the people at the meeting, my record was why I was given ONLY six weeks, there were people that wanted me banned for life. (remember the executive who had the son suspended?)
Fast forward now, one more year to this year, and I am talking to one of our VP's, and he says they really are short of coaches and it's good that I'll be back. When I show up at the rink, they are still short of coaches, and this one "executive" member of the league tells me I am not welcome as a coach in this league.
Now, as the season started, I watch the kids play, and I did notice the kids that had played for us over the years were generally the kids that actually knew how to play the game, fill a gap, cover for each other etc.
After the 1st 10 games of the season ( where my son's coaches missed more than 1/2 the games) a parent had taken the bench in these games a few of the players(his son included) would stay on for 5 or 6 minute shifts.
My son came to his mother and I and said hockey just wasn't fun anymore, and he didn't want to take the time away from school. He is an Ontario Honour Roll student for the last 2 years and heading that way again.
I respect his decision, he wants to go to a different association next year and it makes me mad, because I believe it bothers him more than he would admit, the way I was treated.
Even more aggravating is the fact one parent came to me and said that there was still people angry that we had won a championship a couple of years ago, it really perturbed the executive, cause none of their kids were on our team.
All we ever did was teach our kids how to play, and strive for equal ice time. The kids I have coached over the years still call me coach when we run into each other, and that means more to me than what the executive think.

[cranapple]

Well F.W. , you gotta tell me what rink you where playing out off when you didn't let them do the hand shake. If it was the one down by the football stad. I probably don't blame you but , sorry, I have to slap your wrist!!! especially if it was not alliance or omha. we went into that rink to play an ex. game as a fill when we were in a torney out at dofasco and before the puck hit the ice to start, there allstars (they where bantam allstars 7 yr.s ago) jumped our forwards , and you could tell it was planned. because it was a non sanctioned game, there was nothing that could be done. my son had played binbrook in an o.m.h.a. game the wk, before and they used 3 or 4 of there players, could tell by the socks, probably played for 2 teams. fun eh??

[freshwind]

Cranny~you hit the nail on the head~we WERE playing the team from the rink by the stadium.
It was an alliance tournament.
I had a few good runs in the Dofasco tourney at Christmas as well. Funny, we went to the Dofasco tourney and the fellow running it was my centre back in minor hockey. I guess it's in the blood, eh.
We are going to have to share some stories over a brew someday. Sounds like you've got some good ones.